Indeed, most xtianity sub-sects tend to hold to being exclusionary of anything else. So, while agnosticism and Hinduism might be accommodating, xtianity tends not to be. I’m pretty sure the Kirk kind of xtianity would be.
You’re right that Christianity is exclusionary at the institutional level. Its a part of why the church has generally lost favor in society over time (in addition to rationalism etc.)
But individual Christians can be accommodating so in a universe where JD Vance isn’t trying to turn the US into a white nationalist “utopia” it could work.
One of the core tenets of Christianity is that the only path to salvation is through Christ. That means non Christians are going to hell. That must be hard to accept (that your spouse cannot be heaven bound) but I think many Christians individually try not to think about this too much as they meet good non Christian people while living in pluralistic societies.
There are theological frameworks within Catholicism that seek to be more inclusive (implicit faith, anonymous Christians) but they are not widely accepted within Christianity (or even within Catholicism for that matter).
One of the core tenets of Christianity is that the only path to salvation is through Christ. That means non Christians are going to hell.
This isn’t universally true (and is often a byproduct of most people thinking that the claims of Evangelicals are true; to be fair, it’s in part because they’re so loud and won’t shut up).
Catholicism believes it’s very well possible for non-Christians to go to Heaven (JD Vance, I’m sure, doesn’t but there’s a reason he’s had to’ve been corrected by the Vatican multiple times).
You’re absolutely right I was able to find this 2021 data from Pew:
Catholics are twice as likely as Protestants to say that people who do not believe in God can still go to heaven (68% vs. 34%). Evangelical Protestants are especially likely to view access to heaven as exclusive in this regard, with 71% saying that only those who believe in God can go to heaven, compared with 21% who say nonbelievers can gain entry, while most mainline Protestants (56%) say that people who do not believe in God can go to heaven.
Its certainly more than just Evangelicals and even within Catholicism there isn’t broad agreement (even though it is more open to the idea of implicit faith).
In Catholic teaching, the Catechism (1260‑1261) leaves room for “invincible ignorance,” meaning that people who never hear the Gospel through no fault of their own may still be saved. Past papal statements (e.g., John Paul II’s Redemptor Hominis, Benedict XVI’s Dominus Iesus) reinforce this inclusive possibility, even while affirming that baptism and conscious assent remain the ordinary means of salvation. Surveys of Western Catholics show some acceptance of this view: a 2015 Pew Research Center poll of U.S. adults found that roughly 38 % of self‑identified Catholics agreed that “people of other religions can go to heaven.” Similar European Catholic surveys report figures ranging from 30 % to 45 %, indicating a sizable minority that embraces an inclusive outlook.
Among Protestants, the dominant doctrine of sola fide (faith alone) stresses that personal trust in Christ is the exclusive gateway to eternal life. While some Reformed or liberal evangelical circles entertain concepts like “anonymous Christians” or God’s mysterious mercy, these ideas are not mainstream. Pew’s 2014 study of U.S. Protestants showed that only about 15 % endorsed the statement that “people of other religions can go to heaven,” with higher agreement among mainline denominations (≈20 %) and lower among evangelical/conservative groups (≈10 %).
Generally speaking its a minority of Christians that believe non Christians can go to heaven, especially among Protestants.
Not using poll data from over a decade ago may help with that: https://www.pewresearch.org/. PEW’s 2021 study found that 34% of Protestants believed only those who believed would go to Heaven though that’s largely due to 21% of Evangelicals and 31% of historically black churches: 56% of Mainline Protestants believe people who don’t believe can go Heaven.
And what individual Catholics believe doesn’t matter because Catholics aren’t Protestants; the Magisterium of the Church teaches – multiple times, stretching back to at least the beginning of the last century – that those who don’t believe are capable of going to Heaven. Anyone can believe otherwise but that’s, definitionally, not a Catholic belief (though, for the sake of completeness, it’s 68% of individual Catholics who believe non-believers can go to Heaven, as of 2021).
Again, there’s no way you can say this is true universally and, for neither Catholics nor Mainline Protestants, it’s not a minority who believe it.
EDIT: this would be the second time, in the last 2 days, someone provided updated information that I didn’t see because I was in the middle of writing a reply; looks like you found the same source as I had
Catholicism disagrees with that though! In Catholicism christ is necessary for salvation, and accepting him is the only revealed path to salvation but there is reasonable hope for the salvation of non-believers. That’s why pope Francis was comfortable saying that he hopes hell is empty. The hope that through good works and changes in purgatory all people can be saved.
You’re absolutely right! I was surprised to learn two in three Catholics believe non Christians can go to heaven (see the link to 2021 Pew data in my other reply).
Yes. I’ve run across many tolerant xtians (many in my own family) during my life and you are not wrong.
Now I know that some xtians would definitely say other xtians are not “real” xtians unless they believe certain things, but there are definitely xtian denominations that don’t think the only way to salvation is through Jesus, so it’s not just down to individuals.
Thats really a socially dependent statement. Historically when catholicism and protestantism were being forced on people during historical periods of colonialism, they were very concessionary if it ultimately adopted people into the faith that they were trying to push. They really let plenty of things go in terms of merging Christianity with indigenous belief systems and cosmologies. Just look at sanataria or the merging of voodoo with Christianity in the Caribbean and the southern US as one example. These are mixed belief systems, that are technically primarily Christianity, that are still often practiced today
European hard exclusion of various Christian perspectives from one another I think served as an example to later Europeans that just wanted to broadly legitimize their particular strain as easily as possible. It was easier to bend the religion than try to get people to give up on their already held beliefs. Especially when were talking about an era when Catholicism and Protestantism were large parts of the political justification for ruling monarchs. Jesus being “king of kings” said just as much to legitimize earthly kings as it did about revering Jesus. It’s a vast departure from the modern situation, but back then if too many people under a Catholic monarch suddenly agreed more with this Martin Luther guy or whoever, that could be the end of that monarch
Yes, all true. I think the syncretism that both the Catholic church seems to have done/permitted and those that took it and blended it into other systems (with or without the blessing of the authorities) is partly why the evangelicals react so much to Catholicism. It is quite easy to understand their objections if you see where they are coming from (my/my pastor’s reading of the NT is the only true path to divinity; the Catholic church just added on extra-biblical ritual, dogma, etc.), when you see Mary given almost a similar reverence to their dying-and-rising god. Not to mention that all the saints seem to smack just a little bit of polytheism…
Although the evangelicals reacting to the “paganism” of Catholicism and how it has ruined the purity of the original Word, and so on is just a bit rich, esp. if they are celebrating things like Easter and Christmas. At least to someone not as emotionally attached. :)
Anyway, I think the strain of xtianity that would be affiliated with the likes of Kirk and “JD” “Vance” would not be all that interested in syncretism with anything, really, if I understand them correctly. I’ve certainly known evangelicals that are 100% certain they have it right, most other Protestants have it wrong, the Catholics most definitely have it wrong, and everyone else, including the OG religions that they forked from (the part I find the most hilarious of all), is certainly going to hell. And they have exactly zero interest in blending in anything else; if anything they are obsessed with rooting out and removing any “New Age” influences in what they think is their pure and correct interpretation of religion.
Indeed, most xtianity sub-sects tend to hold to being exclusionary of anything else. So, while agnosticism and Hinduism might be accommodating, xtianity tends not to be. I’m pretty sure the Kirk kind of xtianity would be.
You’re right that Christianity is exclusionary at the institutional level. Its a part of why the church has generally lost favor in society over time (in addition to rationalism etc.)
But individual Christians can be accommodating so in a universe where JD Vance isn’t trying to turn the US into a white nationalist “utopia” it could work.
One of the core tenets of Christianity is that the only path to salvation is through Christ. That means non Christians are going to hell. That must be hard to accept (that your spouse cannot be heaven bound) but I think many Christians individually try not to think about this too much as they meet good non Christian people while living in pluralistic societies.
There are theological frameworks within Catholicism that seek to be more inclusive (implicit faith, anonymous Christians) but they are not widely accepted within Christianity (or even within Catholicism for that matter).
This isn’t universally true (and is often a byproduct of most people thinking that the claims of Evangelicals are true; to be fair, it’s in part because they’re so loud and won’t shut up).
Catholicism believes it’s very well possible for non-Christians to go to Heaven (JD Vance, I’m sure, doesn’t but there’s a reason he’s had to’ve been corrected by the Vatican multiple times).
+1 for “to’ve”. It’s a good word.
You’re absolutely right I was able to find this 2021 data from Pew:
Its certainly more than just Evangelicals and even within Catholicism there isn’t broad agreement (even though it is more open to the idea of implicit faith).
Generally speaking its a minority of Christians that believe non Christians can go to heaven, especially among Protestants.
Not using poll data from over a decade ago may help with that: https://www.pewresearch.org/. PEW’s 2021 study found that 34% of Protestants believed only those who believed would go to Heaven though that’s largely due to 21% of Evangelicals and 31% of historically black churches: 56% of Mainline Protestants believe people who don’t believe can go Heaven.
And what individual Catholics believe doesn’t matter because Catholics aren’t Protestants; the Magisterium of the Church teaches – multiple times, stretching back to at least the beginning of the last century – that those who don’t believe are capable of going to Heaven. Anyone can believe otherwise but that’s, definitionally, not a Catholic belief (though, for the sake of completeness, it’s 68% of individual Catholics who believe non-believers can go to Heaven, as of 2021).
Again, there’s no way you can say this is true universally and, for neither Catholics nor Mainline Protestants, it’s not a minority who believe it.
EDIT: this would be the second time, in the last 2 days, someone provided updated information that I didn’t see because I was in the middle of writing a reply; looks like you found the same source as I had
Catholicism disagrees with that though! In Catholicism christ is necessary for salvation, and accepting him is the only revealed path to salvation but there is reasonable hope for the salvation of non-believers. That’s why pope Francis was comfortable saying that he hopes hell is empty. The hope that through good works and changes in purgatory all people can be saved.
You’re absolutely right! I was surprised to learn two in three Catholics believe non Christians can go to heaven (see the link to 2021 Pew data in my other reply).
Yes. I’ve run across many tolerant xtians (many in my own family) during my life and you are not wrong.
Now I know that some xtians would definitely say other xtians are not “real” xtians unless they believe certain things, but there are definitely xtian denominations that don’t think the only way to salvation is through Jesus, so it’s not just down to individuals.
Name checks out.
Thats really a socially dependent statement. Historically when catholicism and protestantism were being forced on people during historical periods of colonialism, they were very concessionary if it ultimately adopted people into the faith that they were trying to push. They really let plenty of things go in terms of merging Christianity with indigenous belief systems and cosmologies. Just look at sanataria or the merging of voodoo with Christianity in the Caribbean and the southern US as one example. These are mixed belief systems, that are technically primarily Christianity, that are still often practiced today
European hard exclusion of various Christian perspectives from one another I think served as an example to later Europeans that just wanted to broadly legitimize their particular strain as easily as possible. It was easier to bend the religion than try to get people to give up on their already held beliefs. Especially when were talking about an era when Catholicism and Protestantism were large parts of the political justification for ruling monarchs. Jesus being “king of kings” said just as much to legitimize earthly kings as it did about revering Jesus. It’s a vast departure from the modern situation, but back then if too many people under a Catholic monarch suddenly agreed more with this Martin Luther guy or whoever, that could be the end of that monarch
The RC church is a hungry amoeba.
Yes, all true. I think the syncretism that both the Catholic church seems to have done/permitted and those that took it and blended it into other systems (with or without the blessing of the authorities) is partly why the evangelicals react so much to Catholicism. It is quite easy to understand their objections if you see where they are coming from (my/my pastor’s reading of the NT is the only true path to divinity; the Catholic church just added on extra-biblical ritual, dogma, etc.), when you see Mary given almost a similar reverence to their dying-and-rising god. Not to mention that all the saints seem to smack just a little bit of polytheism…
Although the evangelicals reacting to the “paganism” of Catholicism and how it has ruined the purity of the original Word, and so on is just a bit rich, esp. if they are celebrating things like Easter and Christmas. At least to someone not as emotionally attached. :)
Anyway, I think the strain of xtianity that would be affiliated with the likes of Kirk and “JD” “Vance” would not be all that interested in syncretism with anything, really, if I understand them correctly. I’ve certainly known evangelicals that are 100% certain they have it right, most other Protestants have it wrong, the Catholics most definitely have it wrong, and everyone else, including the OG religions that they forked from (the part I find the most hilarious of all), is certainly going to hell. And they have exactly zero interest in blending in anything else; if anything they are obsessed with rooting out and removing any “New Age” influences in what they think is their pure and correct interpretation of religion.