We need to switch from our current American view that all nudity is sexual. If you see a someone naked doesn’t automatically make it sexual!
I mean, sure. But also need to switch from our current US American view that sexuality is bad
People need to spend a little time at a nudist resort. They’d learn real quick that naked isn’t sexual.
Idk, I feel like for some people it is and for some it isn’t.
Like tbh I’d be worried about going to a nudist resort because (despite the trope that “only people you don’t want to see go there”) if I saw a woman I was attracted to I’d be worried that it would be…uh…evident, and that seems awkward and idk if it’s like, allowed to become tumescent even if it is an uncontrollable biological response (never stopped anyone from being mad it happened before, so…)
Idk, if I saw a woman walking down the street tits akimbo, I’d definitely be more inclined to think “ayy hell yeah” in my head than not, even if it happened daily, I can’t just stop being attracted to women, ya know?
Not that I think she shouldn’t, it’s her right and I wouldn’t complain about seeing them, but I can’t control my uncontrollable biological responses of “attraction” nor what happens naturally when “attracted,” if you will (though outside of nudist resorts, it’s hidable enough because clothes.)
Boiling it down to a purely biological process is oversimplified. Unless you are getting aroused whenever you see an attractive person, simply removing clothing isn’t/shouldn’t be a variable. You’ve been socially conditioned to think of all nudity as sexual. Spending time in a nudist area is somewhat about decoupling nudity and sex. (yes there are those that go for the sex, and it’s kinda the leading reason.) I think the point of being human is all about control over ones self and environment. Hell humans have spent more time on this earth walking around naked than clothed. Our current views on nudity and sexuality is relatively new due to social, political, religious, and practical reasons. (you don’t want someone nude preparing large amounts of food or people in hospitals being needlessly naked for obvious reasons.) Ultimately I’m saying if you are worried about being in a public nudity area and not being able to separate the other human from their body/attractiveness, it might be something you should explore. So you can be more open to others in general.
I agree. There’s such shame and disgust around the work of art that is the human body that really needs to be worked on.
Some of y’all should be ashamed.
Are you male or female? In this case, it matters.
You see, males (for the most part) ARE attracted to breasts! It’s hard wired in our brains! Even gay friends have an obsession with boobs! We men LOVE boobs!!
If you want to go topless, I say: FUCK YEAH!!! But I feel like the disconnect comes from some people feeling violated if men stare. I’m sorry, but if there are boobs within eyeshot, I’m gonna be looking at them. I might try to hide my gaze (because I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable), but I’m gonna be checking them out. As frequently as possible. Because…boobs!!
I’m sorry if this is not the kind of response you were looking for, but…BOOBS!!
I’m a cis heterosexual male. I love all things about a women’s body, but I’m mature enough to not pop a boner just because I see a naked attractive woman. Like is that honestly hard for some healthy adult men?! Like if that woman and I are making sexual advances towards each, game on! Otherwise, what’s the big deal?
You are talking about culture not purely biological. Before clothing men weren’t walking around with erections all day. Same thing goes for many other cultures. The obsession with seeing anything naked is because we treat all nudity equally when it’s not. I see it as a personal control and character issue that is ingrained in western and Abrahamic religions areas.
I’m not saying I would be walking around with a boner. I’m saying I would want to look at naked breasts because I appreciate female bodies (in this case, specifically the chesticle region) no matter the shape. Are you shaming me for that?
Sure, if everyone walked around naked 24/7, it would probably be less of an issue. Do you believe that everyone walking around naked 24/7 is a viable option?
And also, you seriously believe that it is an issue ONLY with Western cultures and Abrahamic religions?! I’m starting to think you have never spoken to someone from China or Japan about their societal norms.
I disagree that it’s “hardwired in our brains”. It certainly has a strong cultural bias. Also, I kinda look at it like a gynologist: If you’ve seen 20 of them naked, it gets boring and you stop staring, I guess.
On the other hand, I’m gay and breasts just don’t do anything for me. Now a guy with a decent set of pecs (but not ridiculously oversized), now we’re talking.
Free the boobies
It’s really just free the nipple, which highlights how ridiculous it is. Even more so when you see images where male nipples have been pasted over female nipples, which would theoretically make those images ok.
I’m getting flashbacks to Tumblr’s “female-presenting nipples” censorship rules during the porn ban.
Also legal in Ontario, Canada. A woman was arrested for walking around topless in hot weather. She was finned by police but topless men in the area were not. Ontario courts eventually rulled this was discriminatory but the provincial government did not appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada so the ruling only applies in Ontario.
Yeah despite there being a law against discrimination, the cops are obviously going to use their subjective view of things like lewd behaviour to charge topless women where they wouldn’t men.
Legal in more states now. https://gotopless.org/topless-laws
In Washington state, you can just be nude. As long as you are not doing anything to be “obscene”.
Oregon too, last I knew at least.
This is, in fact, what makes Portland’s annual naked bike ride event possible.
Yes, Portland had decriminalized public nudity if participating in a peaceful protest, while not engaging in sexual conduct, and away from certain restricted areas like parks and schools. The annual naked bike ride is an organized peaceful protest that chooses its route appropriately as to not encroach on any areas where public nudity would otherwise be prohibited.
Naked siblings, through and through.
What are you doing, step-city?
Whipping out my Oregon
Equal protection clause. Any law that imposes itself on women and not men should be unconstitutional.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
YES
END THE HYPOCRISY
👏 FORCE
👏 MEN
👏 TO
👏 WEAR
👏 SHIRTS!^^^apologies, i should have appended an ‘/s’^^^
Heck nah, free the tiddy. I’m transitioning and I wanna be able to show off what I’ve grown when I’m able haha
Also just like, can we all stop making everything sexual and let peoples bodies exist. Instead of hiding everything and making ourselves feel ashamed of our bodies
Hooray!
…for Boobies!
Username checks out.
Same goes for NY.
I know this because at the college I worked at, a city public safety officer walked up to a young man who was sunbathing on campus thinking it was a woman, and told him to put his shirt back on or be charged with indecency or something. The school was outraged and had a shirtless demonstration march around town.
Did a I mention it was an all girls school?
I found this map: https://gotopless.org/topless-laws The religion behind this site seems kind of strange.
The religion behind this site seems kind of strange.
Extraterrestrials Created All Life On Earth
Let’s Build An Embassy To Welcome Them
Why is it not legal everywhere that it is for men? This is ass backwards lol. I just always assumed it was more of a women saying “not gonna do that cause pervs” type thing and how overly sexualized boobs are
But since its not a protected class I assume businesses can turn them away
Most businesses will turn away anyone shirtless, especially where health code violations come into play.
Why is it not healthy for me to eat without a shirt again??
It’s not healthy for others for you to eat without a shirt
Why?
Because (in your case) it would be vomit inducing!
🤣 Just joshing you.
I have an “umm what about” regarding “of all ages.”
Say a 15 year old girl decides to walk topless down main street. Is everyone on that street who has a security camera running going to be convicted of making child porn?
I don’t trust the legislature to have been competent enough to edit the rest of the code to reflect that change nor do I trust the thin blue line punisher sticker crowd to pass up something they can portray as a crime.
You are sexualizing nudity. This is the bulk of the problem.
No (s)he’s not, this is VERY pragmatic. US police officers love pushing their authority up your rear end given the chance, and if you even accidentally recorded a topless minor, you could be in for.some fun.
- am I the one doing that? And 2. Is it the bulk of the problem?
Me personally, I have no particular need for legislated prudishness. I don’t see much of a difference between the Taliban requiring women to wear a headscarf than whatever red state requiring women to wear a top. A lot of that nonsense is done to enforce a particular religion, and I personally want all religions to be thrown in the toilet with all the other worthless assgarbage.
There was a point in time when things such as bikinis and miniskirts were seen as scandalously immodest. The people who saw them that way are mostly dead now and we can move on, which is what will ultimately happen here. Some women will start going topless to the beach, the newspapers will write some stories about it, there’ll be some arrests, there will be some court cases, there will be some laws passed, and then it’ll settle in as just a thing people do sometimes.
The problem I have is that I think people with cameras are going to be punished for incidentally filming topless girls in ways they’re not for incidentally filming topless boys. Shall I illustrate with an example?
Consider this video of a walking tour of Panama City Beach, Florida. . There are a lot of videos like this, tours of various places around the world, they’re filmed in public places, often from streets, sidewalks etc. There’s a lengthy segment where the cameraperson walks down the beach and records several boys and men without shirts on. The video is on Youtube, uncensored and monetized. No one anywhere has a problem with this because we categorically do not consider male barechestedness to be nudity.
The argument here is women and girls should be allowed to be barechested anywhere men and boys are. Okay, so the instant we make that change, we also need to change the rules that say it’s not okay to see, photograph, record or broadcast barechested women and girls. It needs to be equally okay to upload pictures of barechested women and girls to Youtube without censor bars or blurs. Because then it becomes “when he does it it’s not nudity, when she does it, it’s not considered nudity but it is still in fact nudity.” You don’t get to require people in public to avert their gaze.
To answer your question seriously, no. Having pictures or videos of a 15 year olds breast is not by default porn, it’s only porn once it’s in a sexual context.
Does “in a sexual context” have a falsifiable definition? I mean, here’s an article from the American Bar Association journal about a man who was arrested and deported for “child sexual abuse” for having photos printed of himself kissing his infant daughter after a bath.
The accuser was the photo lab tech. After the man was arrested and deported, his wife was arrested, their child was removed from them, then the investigation took the whole roll of film into consideration and found there was no child abuse, this was photographic evidence of loving parents caring for their child. “Sexual context” indeed.
I envision a future where a business owner puts up security cameras around his shop, those security cameras send their video to “The Cloud,” an underage girl walks by topless in view of those video cameras, as is her legal right to do so, a closed-source unauditable CSAM detection algorithm running on “The Cloud” flags the video as CSAM, and the business owner gets arrested, his business and/or home destroyed or even killed before an investigation determines no wrongdoing. Because we put the time for reasonableness after the bodies have cooled. We check to see if it’s a false positive after the “arrest” has been made. THAT’s the ultimate problem I have here.
The prohibition on public exposure of breasts by women and girls over 10 years old is now gone from the city code as of this week.
I never thought I’d be conflicted on this, because I am absolutely of the opinion that female breasts and nipples shouldn’t be treated as exclusively sexual body parts, especially since men have them too and we aren’t held to that standard.
But being confronted with the idea that 10-17 year old girls can now bare their breasts in public without restraint reminds me that treating female bodies as non-sexual is great as an ethos, but it is not reflective of reality, and that this specifically could be problematic.
But how to solve it? You can’t make it an 18+ only rule, or you’re further entrenching the idea that female breasts are exclusively sexual and adult, but if you let teens and tweens go topless, they will be sexualized / ogled / photographed by adult men, and that’s a bad precedent to set as acceptable. We usually treat photographs of underage female breasts as a form of CSAM, but can we still say that if we’re treating female breasts as non-sexual? This is an interesting new line to draw, given societal attitudes on adolescent nudity.
Regretfully, I believe that the true problem is men. The reason women have to cover their breasts is because they have to protect themselves from men. I’m all for bodily liberation and the de-sexualization of female existence, but we need an overhaul on our society’s attitudes towards women in general if we’re going to get there. Maybe bare breasts help get us there. Maybe girls need to learn the right way how to kick a man in the balls before they go topless.
I feel like the simple solution is that if you can’t have topless kids because of pervs, then you can’t have topless kids and gender isn’t part of it
So you feel that women should be arrested and prosecutable if their nipples are exposed?
That’s very misogynist. And no, you can’t argue for the law to “save the women” from all those perverts. Because the whole point of this is to free women from the bullshit laws that allows society to prosecute them while pulling double duty by effectively shaming their bodies.
Most women are not going to run around topless voluntarily. But, even if they did - say a group of girls or women decided to go skinny dipping or whatever at a lake, do you really believe they should go to jail for that?
Don’t mansplane and tell everyone these laws are for women’s own good, because they aren’t. Inventing this bizarre photographic scenario is just bizarre. It’s a fiction of your imagination and is a straw man argument.
You are correct that the true problem is men, but not how you think it is.
Tits are not sex organs.
