That’s literally the opposite of what the Dem leadership ever does. Expecting them to put the outcomes for regular people over system rules and norms (and their owner donors) is like expecting a sheep to become an obligate carnivore.
Neoliberals don’t change the system, they ARE the system. You’re not going to get systemic change from someone whose raison d’être is protecting the norms and rules at all costs.
old guard dems are just GOP in disguise, because they often work together behind the scenes making deals, they both of the same megadonors, additionally they hope to get by being “not-republican” candidates.
Nope.
Dems try to adhere to The Rules And Procedures
Pubs don’t give a shit
That first part is kinda what I’m saying: Dems adhere to the rules and procedures even when it prevents them from taking completely reasonable actions that the people who they’re supposed to represent want.
Republicans break all rules and norms to do awful things and Dems refuse to break any rules or norms to stop them.
It’s like a fistfight where one fighter is wielding a sawed off shotgun and the other refuses to even fight dirty.
Well this is the bitch: you can’t play that game. Because the whole point of that game to smash the rules of order. To destroy the social contract. To create chaos and revoke rights. Any move you make is a win for them and a loss for everyone else.
Don’t play chess with pigeons
That’s a false dichotomy.
You’re assuming that the only alternative to slavishly adhering to the rules as determined by people who could not possibly predict today’s circumstances is to ignore the very concept of rules and procedure.
I’m not advocating for Dems to do either. I’m advocating for them to change the rules for the better when they can and to bend or even outright break them when it’s necessary and justified.
Following rules for their own sake even when it’s clearly contrary to the needs and wants of the people is just a more socially acceptable form of authoritarianism.
Not assuming a falsity at all - the rules in question are due process
So THAT’S where you want the goal posts now?
Sure, due process is an inalienable human right that should never be infringed upon.
That obviously wasn’t what I was talking about, though.
Sorry, should have been clearer: due LEGISLATIVE process
So how it usually plays out is that destroying is usually much easier than building.
So if the oligarchs destroy the rules, you will not win by trying to rebuild them. You will only get back to some sense of normal by shooting back and making them understand why the rules were there. And I don’t mean threats.
The moment the office of the president was given complete immunity from everything, Biden should have had Musk shot. More realistically, Dems should have fought judicial appointments the same way as Reps did, and actually appointed activist judges instead of trying and failing to appoing Merrick fucking Garland.
The eleventh hour of the “system” was prosecuting Trump. That system does not exist anymore, there is nothing to defend at this point.
And that attitude is how we got here:
Dems try to adhere to The Rules And Procedures
Tell that to Nancy’s stock portfolio… Or is that “legal”?
Either way they’re 2 rich 2 resist.
They’ve got dozens of excuses for failure, that’s just one of them.
lmao what
you still believe in these fucks?
System’s broken. We don’t need a different party in charge of the system we need a new system.
Agreed. The US is over. These people are bouncing the entire stock market up and down using tariffs and doing insider trading on it … there is no justice whatsoever.
Not to mention the concentration/death camps and lack of free speech.
I mean, considering my post from the last 4 months you guys are making me so proud to be on lemmy right now.
This is why Sanders has told new politicians to run as independents, neither of the current parties can be trusted
Approval voting and more parties could theoretically improve things quite a bit. But switching to approval voting is probably not simple because why should the biggest parties support something that hurts them.
There are good democrats out there - many of us have met them in person. Just that the leadership, and threats from AIPAC money, twist them into not doing everything they can.
I wouldn’t be so pessimistic as to say EVERY person in the US looking into politics is corrupt. Just make sure to actually name people when lambasting them, not paint a wide swath.
There are good democrats out there
That may be true but isn’t relevant really. A few decent people in a party will not fundamentally change our system.
ADAB? Basically the same idea.
Edit: I feel like I might be misunderstanding something since I’m getting downvoted. Isn’t that same mindset similar to the sentiment behind ACAB? If not please explain how they are different.
Cops are inherently bastards because they are part of a bastardized system and even if you are a “good cop” you are still perpetuating the system. That would be similar to being part of the democratic party as a progressive where you may be a “good dem” but they are still perpetuating the system by being beholden to the two party system.
People who are swayed by AIPAC money and democratic leadership are not actually “good people”.
I’d recommend you take a look at a Zeteo interview of two Congress members who stood against them. It can be more complex than straight bribery.
For one thing, taking money from AIPAC isn’t just about greed; it’s also about using that money to campaign and help people be aware of what issues they’re fighting for. (Yes, I’m aware for some, it’s all about power and greed)
For another, AIPAC money can become an enemy: These Congress members got an army of mailings demonizing them as soon as they voted against an issue Israel wanted in their corner. They were voted out of office, and never got to pass the causes they wanted for their communities.
Should they take AIPAC money? Absolutely not. Do I see why they’d take it? Absolutely.
Democrats are centrist liberals. They are capitalists. They are cop-loving authoritarians. They will never fulfill your leftist liberatory desires. Stop deferring your political will to wishes they will never manifest. You have Stockholm Syndrome. Go do something yourself that matters to you in your own community.
Well said, I’m still going to post my opinions but there’s really nothing you’ve said that I can refute.
I should probably add: I don’t mean to be a dick. I say all this stuff because I care, I hate seeing comrades efforts and dreams and desires frustrated by this deadend political party year after year, election after election. I imagine if all the passion we drained into the DNC instead went into creative modes of organization and direct action in our own towns and cities?
All I can see doing right now is try to raise consciousness about what the midterms will mean. I don’t think they are going to do a behind closed doors steal. This administration couldn’t plan anything requiring that level of coordination. No, I think they will do it all right infront of our eyes. Closing polling places. Rampant voter intimidation. State governments interfering. All leading up to forcing scotuses hand.
People aren’t going to know how to react and ultimately they will walk away feeling defeated. Really we need to accept now that the midterms are going to be sabotaged and take to the street before hand. That’s not going to happen because as much as I plead no one will listen until it’s too late.
Even now we see trumps agenda stalling out. What i believe is happening is they are promising him everything for after midterms. That’s why you don’t see him going scorched earth. If you don’t think his cabinet is planning their reichstag fire as we speak then you haven’t been paying attention for the last 9 years.
They would need to grow spines first.
A Democrat would never do it. You’d need an actual Leftist. They’d be the only ones with enough spine to sacrifice their own political career and reputation to get it done.
Yeah, but a bj in the oval office? I mean, have you met Hilary???
True. Democrats only want to govern like actual adults.
They’re so obsessed with acting like the adults in the room that they give up everything that actually matters
Liberals will watch you drown in a swamp and then they will brag about how they kept their hands clean.
And as you’re drowning they’ll patronizingly lecture you about “not understanding how things work”, then tell you to trust the process and launch into a speech about the next election
And finally snap at you for annoying them with your incessant requests to “do something”
I can’t blame you if you prefer the orderliness of corporatism over the chaos of fascism, but the former always ultimately leads to the latter. At some point, you have to get rid of one to prevent the other.
Letting tens of thousands of people die without access to healthcare is acting like an adult???
Liberals are the epitome of the trolley fallacy: passive choices are still choices, letting someone drown in a nasty swamp because you want to stay clean is social murder. Liberals might appear to have clean hands, but their souls are soiled by the deaths of all the people they chose not to help
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Pandora’s box is opened, and once that happens, it’s almost impossible to close it. I’m going to be honest, the next election cycle, I’ll consider voting for the blue equivalent of Trump. Now that we know presidents can act like kings, it’s time progressives capitalized on that. Why not lock up rightwingers and hatemongers, slap tariffs on oil, and deport Zionists in order to fight Islamophobia?
Presidents can act like kings if they have the Legislative and Judicial branches in their pocket. No progressive ever will.
Have you met democrats?
Is Cuomo running? I hadn’t heard
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“Don’t call me ‘Christy,’ I’m not one of your strippers.”
“…you could be…”
ETA: you basically just said Avasarala twice.
It’s rather optimistic assuming that Republicans would act like they gave a shit about rule of law if they were the ones who wrote them. Laws are just for everyone else, in their minds.
Like it or not Republicans do work in the confines of the law. Now, sometimes they make work around or challenge some stuff but that’s the exception more than the rule. Complete lawlessness is only something recently the GOP has started dabbling in.
Presidential immunity gives a democratic incumbent the right to slap a republican senator daily
“If” doing some heavy lifting there
As a dem voter I’m use to betting on precariously placed ‘ifs.’
If we manage to have another presidential election, I will be behind any progressive or Democrat that promises to use the presidency in the exact way as Trump.
Forcing an rewritten version of the Constitution that eliminates flaws and loopholes, enacting term and age limits on all elected offices and the judiciary, deleting the electoral college, and so forth?
I am in.
The US needs a proportional voting system first and foremost
We’re due for some public executions
Sorry, I get the spirit of the meme and it’s nice to daydream but fuck no. I don’t trust the Democrats to do anything in the interest of the people.
It’s not whether you trust one absolutely or not.
It’s always, as ever, relative. You pick between the options for the best bad option or you abdicate your vote and then must suffer (potentially) the worst of both worlds.
What I mean is I don’t want the Democrats to go hog wild with the law the same way the Republicans are because they are also owned by the Capitalists. Since I don’t have another choice of course I’m very likely to Vote Blue No Matter Who™️ to my great displeasure, unless a more progressive party takes the lead by a landslide and actually has a good chance of winning
Ideally they’d take over the Dem party since it would solve multiple problems simultaneously: a relevant progressive party + existing infrastructure + no neoliberal faux-progressive party that would split their vote
And that’s why you have Trump destroying lives and sending the world in a vector towards endless war. Because people like you don’t trust Democrats, in spite of their legislation and vote history.
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I don’t trust them but they’ve gotten my vote consistently so I’m not sure why my trust has affected anything other than the calls I’ve made to their offices
You’re not exactly out here in public promoting them.
I don’t trust the Democrats to do anything in the interest of the people.
If anything you’re telling people not to vote for them.
Correct. They have not earned my vote. I will not promote them. They deserve my vote and my support as much as someone pointing a gun at my head does. “Hey, at least I’m not pulling the trigger like that other guy” is not a platform.
I will tell other people to vote for them when there is literally no other option because that’s all that they are - better than the alternative - but they have earned none of the suggestions I give.
At this point the main priority for the democrats has to be reforming the American voting system.
First past the post needs to go away, permanently.
It is ridiculous to have situations where a state population votes 51% for one candidate and 49% for the other, while the state as a whole gets to throw out the 49% of the other candidate.
Once that happens, other parties will spring up and actually have a possible way to get elected.
I’ve always agreed, though some have needlessly stood in opposition. The fact is someone else has to take the wheel, and win, for it to happen and democrats at large aren’t creative enough to get it done.
I wish, but that’s the opposite of the goal of the democratic party. They don’t see themselves as the opposition to the Republican party. Only priorities are maintaining the status quo and getting funding. That does tend to be better for us than the alternative, but any downstream benefits are mostly a happy accident.
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