As America backslides into fascism and authoritarian consolidation, what do you think should be done to course correct?
If I recall, killing Nazis worked in WWII.
Your account is only 3 weeks old?
Except we didn’t kill any American Nazis, we just left them alone to fester
Hell, we imported a few of them from Germany.
We fought fascists overseas to keep us from fighting fascists at home…
As part of an organized war between opposing imperialist nations. I’m not seeing how that’s going to happen here.
Clearly we need a civil war
You’d need to recruit a significant proportion of the military for that to work. It didn’t go so hot for the last guys that tried this.
Do you mean the confederates who, by a different name, are in power right now?
The Capitalists won the civil war.
when are you gonna kill a fascist? i think you’re an empty troll
I think you voted for Trump
The two key turning points are going to be the midterms and when it comes time for the next election. Depending on how those events go, and if Trump hasn’t died at some point in the next couple years (either from natural causes or because someone learns how to aim), things will likely go one of two wildly different directions.
If we actually have elections, and if the gerrymandering isn’t so horrendous that it’s impossible to overcome we’ll hopefully see a Democrat elected and we’ll start the incredibly slow crawl back to normalcy, hopefully with some significant reforms to make sure this shit doesn’t happen again. The process is going to take decades to unwind all the damage Trump has managed in just a few years, but in theory we’ll get there eventually.
On the other hand, we could go the opposite direction. Republicans retain the majority in the midterms, and then when the next primary comes around either we just don’t have an election or Trump “wins” a 3rd term despite that being unconstitutional. At that point we’re likely looking at either a civil war, or the US being defeated in a 3rd world war like Germany was in order to undo all this crap. Neither option is good and if things get to that point the world is fucked, the US doubly so.
we’ll start the incredibly slow crawl back to normalcy, hopefully with some significant reforms to make sure this shit doesn’t happen again
And then the democrats will lose the midterm, which will lock up Congress and maybe get the president impeached, and we’ll be back to this shit again.
This has happened every decade for my entire fucking life.
The Dems have to stop being weak ass babies and just do what they want. If the right can do it why can’t the left. Fuck norms and traditions.
For 98% of Dems (the politicians, I mean–I don’t think the percentage is as high among the general population) being weak ass babies is what they want. “Norms and traditions” is their ideology.
I can’t believe people still have faith in fair elections. He tried to cheat his first win. He refused to leave after his loss to Biden and tried to overthrow the government. Then he cheated again last year.
And for some reason you think the midterms will be open and fair?! That he’ll even hold them at all? Or will allow them to be fair without cheating or intimidation? Or will actually obey the results? He doesn’t listen to Congress now! Why would he start if the Dems won?!
And if by some miracle all of that worked out you think the Dems are going to start fighting back now? This isn’t a political fight. It’s a class fight and most of the Dems are in the owner class. That’s why they go along with all this.
Stop relying on the next election. You don’t vote your way out of fascism. Totalitarian leaders do not value elections. He will not leave or give up power.
when the next primary comes around either we just don’t have an election or Trump “wins” a 3rd term despite that being unconstitutional
And all the mainstream media will go about how this is an unusual turn with side panels of experts “debating” what Constitutional means…
The best of the worst cases is the US goes completely isolationist as the world turns from them and it all burns itself out into something different. I do not want this to spread out, and other countries need to pay attention once again and stop pretending it’s fine. That’s what really bothers me, even other leaders play the game instead of refusing to deal with him face to face. I guess they’re doing that high road mess and using economic tactics to hit back.
Best case - mid terms have significant traction and shut him down, assuming he’s still around. If he’s not, Vance or whoever fails to keep what cultists there are still and there’s something left to piece back together. But shit, it has to be better than what we had, otherwise it’s just going to keep happening. In essence this is core Reconstruction failure and continued rot over more than a century. We really should have improved by now.
The oligarch should be banned from other countries. Why let them in to spread they’re hate.
So the hope is that things are bad enough that voters finally learn their lesson but not bad enough that their votes don’t matter…
Trump hasn’t even been in a year yet. Shits going to go downhill.
They need to protest. REALLY protest. General strikes, obstruction, shut down everything. You can’t walk around with a sign on a weekend once a month when it’s nice outside and expect a wannabe dictator will back down. They are spendinrg every minute of every day stripping away your democracy and you have to fight back with the same intensity.
Look at Nepal. France. Italy. They didn’t ask their government to listen. They MADE them. It’s YOUR country! Fight for it!
Yeah but Netflix has some shows I need to watch and I can’t do that from jail, soooo… fascism I guess.
More like food is expensive as hell and so I can’t really afford to loose my pay check. Which is why organizing often starts as mutual aide.
And advocating for a general strike is ILLEGAL and a very easy charge in Trump’s America at this point.
I’ve been rolling around forums and whatnot to see the interest for such topics, and they seem high, but no one is talking about what I’m supposed to do to pay for my pets and apartment when I have 0 support structures in a deeply red state. They don’t treat the homeless very well here, and it’s freezing half the year.
Not that you’re saying it’s easy, you rightly pointed out food too. I just wish there were more resources, or ways to get connected. My community does the No Kings protests, but most of them balked at the Kirk shooting so they’re not quite radicalized enough for the other actions that a not-entirely-peaceful protest would bring.
So have no savings?
I have a little, it’s to try and get me and my partner the hell out of this state. Not enough for a house, but enough for a used car and a u-haul and first and last month’s rent somewhere else.
A lot of us are living paycheck to paycheck, we’re lucky to be a bit above that and not have kids. Almost all the people we know from high school and college are in worse boats than us.
Personally, I think more of use should do little things, like damage government buildings, infrastructure, etc. primarily of right wing assets. You can get a used paintball gun pretty cheep, and in the dead of night from far away you could pelt a building with red paint relatively quiet.
Paintball guns are not exactly quiet and don’t have sufficient range to even allow you to stand outside the parking lot of most Federal buildings and still reach them, let alone outside of the purview of their security cameras. When you’re caught you’ll inevitably be holding a Gun Shaped Object, which is unlikely to go down well. I admire the spirit, but I’d advise you to think about that one a smidge harder, if I were you.
If you’re going to sabotage, then sabotage. Don’t go for middle school level vandalism pranks.
Paintball trebuchet it is then
I’m down. How many 55 gallon drums full of 'em are we chucking?
Nah, it’ll be gym balls
I’m waiting
Give me an example of an act that would meet your qualifications
Creating a security incident at a federal facility and then getting away. You don’t even have to do anything, just cause the alarm. For Example:
Drone “bombing,” meaning just fly a normal drone into a federal facility.
Puncture the tires of Federal Vehicles.
Post CEO home addresses online.
People who can’t afford to unionize cannot afford to not unionize.
I think what needs to be said here is- yes it’s so terrible but in general day to day life for everyday Americans hasn’t really changed. That and the general ignorance of things means that people really are not ready to “go strike” or do anything at all.
The overall attitude is more “this is slightly annoying at most” and that is not the attitude that leads to general strikes (nor can most afford to do that here anyway.)
Everyone on the outside in is saying this and that- most Americans don’t know or aren’t affected enough from what they understand to make those steps.
That is reality here. Like I get the arguments but you also have to understand it isn’t bad enough for most people. My thought is once it is it’ll all be way too late.
And France protested but it wasn’t or wouldn’t effect they’re everyday life. But they obviously pay more attention.
Consider Spain, Argentina, France, Italy, Libya, Panama, Syria, Germany
The only thing that works once these fools get entrenched into the political machine is a good old fashioned ass whoopin.
FWIW this is why I think it’s so important to keep the farmers and union workers on our side. They are the means by which everything else is built upon. If they’re on the other side, well then the machine can keep on grinding.
Hey silver lining, Trump seems to be doing a really good job of pissing off the military leadership and the common soldiers as well. The only ones that are actually supporting him are nut jobs, the grifters who think they can use him, and executives who think they can squeeze more profit out by crawling up his ass.
As for farmers that’s kind of a mixed bag. The problem isn’t so much that they’ll support him as it is that there might not be many of them left. Trumps policies are bankrupting farmers at a record rate and their farms are being snapped up by foreign holding companies. Most of them are going to end up working farms they no longer own.
Most of them are going to end up working farms they no longer own.
A lot of farmers are killing themselves. The US will have to give migrant workers a path in - which is kind of big picture funny.
Sharecroppers
for all their bullshit, conservatives have never given a fuck about farmers. if they did, we wouldn’t have a migration issue at all.
FWIW this is why I think it’s so important to keep the farmers and union workers on our side.
WHELP
General strikes should have happened months ago. You’re actively letting Maga normalize miltary troops quelling protests.
There is nothing to be done if your head is stuck in the old world, which is where 98% of Americans still live.
All I’ve seen on social media are two distinct camps: someone help us, please we don’t want this, and are you fucking crazy I have a family and a job I cannot do anything.
Enjoy the fascism, you’ve earned it. You’ll just have to learn your lesson the hard way, a la climate change. This is only a sneak preview of what happens when you ignore the obvious for too long.
Exactly they are at war and don’t want to do anything. Oh well they deserve what they get.
They got really, really fat, drunk and horny off the American exceptionalism post-WW2, and they never came down from the high.
This is that, catching up with them. They’re not taking it well. Most of them still refuse to believe it.
Strikes no longer work in this Country. The strike would have to be until something happens. Like a hunger strike. The end is death Unless change. But I think we all know that isn’t going to happen
Even my dumb as shit family members who voted for trump are beginning to turn on him. I don’t think Americans really have any tolerance for his turn to fascist dictatorship. Sure, a few deplorables out there do - but we outnumber them 100 to 1.
Personally I think MAGA is going to eat itself. Especially if Trump dies in his sleep.
The real problem is this cycle will happen again in if we don’t have a reckoning where the fascists and their sympathizers are made to permanently renounce those leanings. I think we should take their trigger fingers.
The problem is they are beginning to. They should have been against him way back in 2020 when he left
Taking their trigger fingers is probably the nicest thing I’d do
lol user name checks out
Are you pro fascist? lol
I mean… if we are to take the batman approach and let them live, then we need ironclad solutions to prevent this shit from happening again. Loss of trigger finger for sure. Make them record “I was wrong and my decisions led to the destruction of people’s livelihoods and the deaths of innocent people. Do not let me do this again. Do not let other people do this in the future. We must learn from our mistakes and I will be held accountable for the rest of my life.” and if they refuse to repeat that while facing a camera, then they get to rot in a cell until they do. Make those recordings public and make them watch those recordings. And they don’t get to vote.
Oh no what we’ll they do with all of their money.
Good point. I was thinking that every elected official should have all of their money and assets forfeited. And those of immediate family members. And have trials on a case by case basis to take the assets of anyone who they materially helped with the undue influence of their position.
Renounce oh no they couldn’t be lying about it. Oh no they would never do that. Sorry public executions.
For inspiration you can look into what the countries the US implanted dictatorships in did
Every time I say it I get banned. I say, we remove the people who silence us.
Librarians?
Fascists!!! Close the book on them.
Yeah they will just shut us down.
Discover socialism. Not commie tanky left authoritarian bullshit. Just the moderate basic human decency stuff.
Old fashioned people caring about each other. Workers supporting each other. Vets supporting each other. Women supporting each other. Families supporting each other. Neighborhoods supporting each other. Inclusivity. Opportunity. Holding out a hand to the less fortunate. Redistributing wealth so people can have dignity and hope.
Start with taking back schools as safe places from gun massacres. If you can’t do that you can’t do shit. It’s a basic litmus test for a functional society. Take back streets for pedestrians. Take prisons and hospitals away from corporations. Get rid of tipping in favour of a fair living wage. Take a fucking holiday occasionally. It won’t kill you.
The problem is Americans are kept ignorant about what is possible. In place of knowledge all they have is lies. What is the point of change if you don’t even know what you want. You will just end up with more of the same.
On god please. However,
Start with taking back schools as safe places from gun massacres. If you can’t do that you can’t do shit. It’s a basic litmus test for a functional society.
Is not even close to true. There’s far more important issues to tackle that kill more kids. Focusing on that as the baseline when it’s tiny compared to the damage companies environmental damage and car do to kids is mixed priorities. We can focus on multiple things, but the priority should be on what’s killing the children in far greater numbers compared to the much smaller totals of school shooters. Focusing only on the sensationalist headlines instead of the greater dangers is misdirection from what truly is at the root of the damage to our society .
Which also makes it interesting you point out all Americans have is lies, when you yourself were fed the lie that the most concerning danger to children is guns, instead of cars, or pollution
It’s going to take everyone starving for people to care. I talk to my family and they say “what can we do, let the people who are supposed to fix this do their job”
Everywhere I look people are trying their best to look deeply into their tv shows, streams, video games, porn, etc and just waiting for this to impact them personally before they care enough to do something.
My husband has always said immigrants fleeing their country should stay behind and fight and now he’s looking at countries that would accept us.
I’m kinda at the point where nothing feels right. I don’t feel right. I’m on two antidepressants and I still feel trapped in this hell hole. I’ve always tried to vote and do the right thing and now I’m here.
I signed the strike card at the general strike website but it’s taking too long before they call the strike. I fear that website will get raided and all the sign ups will be lost. 😞
Honestly I’m really pissed we all didn’t start rioting when the Supreme Court ruled it’s okay to racially profile us. That should have been the breaking point for us all.
My husband has always said immigrants fleeing their country should stay behind and fight and now he’s looking at countries that would accept us.
That’s interesting. I’ve always agreed with that logic. But I’ve decided to stick it out no matter what happens.
I signed the strike card at the general strike website but it’s taking too long before they call the strike. I fear that website will get raided and all the sign ups will be lost. 😞
Unfortunately that’s not how strikes work. They need critical mass or it will do nothing. It needs to have everyone on the list willing to risk their house, home, and livelihood to make it happen. And to you need to realize not even close to enough people are willing to do so.
If you haven’t already, try getting a union involved in your workplace, as a unionized workplace will allow far more successful organization of such events. Align a union you create yourself with your coworkers with UAW’s mass strike line, join their cause
Unfortunately I’ve been laid off. So creating a union right now in this economy won’t do much good. I heard the jobs report was massively worse than they made it out to be.
So I guess I’ll have to wait until more people feel the impacts of the failing economy.
America won’t course-correct until it is forced to do so.
The political establishment is so totally insulated in a media bubble that there’s no way to reach them, internal pressures can be safely ignored. Only external pressure can change this country now.
People, on the whole, will choose the easiest path.
People are also really bad at estimating risk, usually overestimating short term risks and underestimating long term risks.
So what happens is that people choose what they estimate to be the easiest path, based on their faulty ideas about what the short and long term risks are.
Which means that in order for real change to happen - by whatever means - people have to perceive that the immediate risk of change is lower than the future risk of staying the same.
8647
The American Empire is falling apart, and has been for quite some time now, what we’re seeing right now is a childish trashing about and refusing to accept reality or adapt to present global conditions. Every year, more and more countries that used to be pro-US turn neutral, and countries that used to be neutral turn towards China. The US will become more and more isolated, diplomatically, economically, and so forth, and it will become increasingly impossible to pretend that it’s “#1,” while domestic conditions get worse and worse.
Soon, if not already, we will be in a situation where the only credible advantage the US has to leverage is the military, and it may choose to start WWIII with China in a desperate attempt to stay on top.
The ruling bourgeoisie don’t really want this, they’re doing just fine in the current system, but stoking fear and hate of the Other distracts from problems at home. The danger is that some true believer is going to get into a position of power. Someone who isn’t just saber-rattling to justify giving more money to the CEOs of Raytheon and Lockheed Martin so they can buy another beach house, but who actually sees a hot war between major, nuclear-armed powers as desirable. The further conditions deteriorate, and the longer we go on with fear and hate being stoked, the more this possibility becomes an inevitability.
If that happens, everyone will lose. If somehow it remains contained and doesn’t end life on earth (as it probably will), then, win or lose, the US will be finished. Maybe the US could throw everything it’s got into stopping China, but then another power will emerge and it’ll be spent.
To avert this future, we need a radical left wing shift, with drastic cuts to the military and the money going towards improving ordinary people’s lives and addressing various domestic crises. The US is not Superman, we are not invulnerable, we do not have the ability to go around the world “fixing” every situation everywhere. Instead, we need to focus on the things we can control, starting with within our own borders. Because when the world sees us falling apart, why would anyone want to follow us anywhere? And repairing domestic issues would go a long way to averting the rise of fascism.
But unfortunately, nobody seems to want this, Republican or Democrat. Every administration keeps funnelling more and more money towards the military, keeps getting involved in conflicts and resorting to force, and keeps failing to address domestic problems. No, we can’t just mind our own business and focus on getting our own shit sorted out, we have to go send bombs to Syria and Yemen and Palestine and Ukraine, bombs bombs bombs, the only currency the US uses in international diplomacy. If we had spent a tenth of the money we’re spending fighting over Ukraine on making life better for ordinary Ukrainians after the end of the Soviet Union, there wouldn’t be a war. And right now, there are tons of countries that are slipping away because we’re too stingy to spend that 1/10th on them (of even on our own people), because building bombs instead helps the rich get richer. But nobody cares. It’s madness.
Either we have some broad social reckoning with our obsession with militarism and hatred of the poor and forigners, or we stay on this idiotic course until we drive off a cliff.
Nothing, look to pre War Germany
A significant percentage of people supoort this, many, many others think they’re not going to be targeted and this will all blow over.
