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Is this actually true? There’s too much disinformation about the shooter, his motivations, his identity, his family, his partner going around that I have no clue what to really believe about him.
(Please, nobody respond to this comment telling me “that’s exactly what they want” without providing a credible source for your claims about the shooter.)
We don’t have confirmation on all of his motives yet; however what we do know about the shooter, his upbringing, lifestyle, etc. is that the poster responding to OP in the image above is largely correct.
There are indeed conflicting accounts that his roommate was trans, or his partner was, or similar. None of that’s been verified yet, and even if so, it doesn’t explain the shooter’s motivations.
What we do know about the shooter is that he largely fits the model of a deeply conservative republican, and that fits with how he was raised, his family, and as his grandmother puts it: “Their family was all MAGA”.
Going off that, and a lot of other circumstantial details/evidence, it’s clear that he was at one point a deeply MAGA character.
Beyond that or what his current motivations are? We can only extrapolate. Those extrapolations largely lead in the direction that he shot Kirk because Kirk didn’t back some of the same extremist beliefs he held. Those beliefs are similar to what Nick Fuentes believes in, which is also why he’s currently being labeled a Gyroper.
According to The Onion, he once had a trans Uber driver so that obviously makes him a leftist.
According to some right-wing spaces (r/conservative on Reddit), there is apparently evidence to suggest that the shooter was an outlier within their otherwise hard-right family.
Is there any evidence to the contrary?
I wouldn’t trust anyone describing his political leanings or motives until court. It’s being twisted around and rumors are spreading like wildfire in a vacuum of actual leadership.
He should not have been shot. The shooter was, like virtually all such people, a narcissistic main character sociopath who only cared about his own fame and notoriety, and was likely spending too much time in the damp and mushroomy corners of the internet instead of developing an actual personality in the real world. He’s less an anti-fascist soldier and more a Travis Bickle wannabe wanker.
But Charlie Kirk was a humongous piece of shit and I am glad he’s dead. One fewer humongous pieces of shit to have to listen to. I would never advocate the murder of a man like him, and like I said, I think the shooter was a colossal cunt who unleashed way more danger and harm to marginalised groups than Kirk was capable of provoking on his own. But thank fuck he’s gone. Silver linings n’all that 🤷
I’m glad he’s gone but this is just what the right needs to go full force Nazi as we have rightly known since it occurred.
Anyone that’s read about the lead-up to WW2 or, well, any historical instance of fascism gaining political control over a country knows that they’re going to keep pushing. They’re going to keep targeting the left. They’re going to ram through executive orders to oppress the left. They’re going to get the SC to make decisions against the left. They’re going to label nebulous entities like ANTIFA (when’s the last time you saw an ANTIFA gathering) as terrorist organizations. They’re going to end up openly calling for genocide. It’s going to happen.
So I implore everyone to arm themselves and form networks with likeminded people. You do not want to start doing this after it’s too late. If you need motivation, start reading up on 1930s Germany (the similarities are undeniable) and follow up with a list of WW2 atrocities. There’s definitely a WIKI page for it.
The number of similarities between modern America and 1930s Germany is shocking.
I believe the assassination of Kirk is highly analogous to the killing of Horst Wessel. Both Wessel and Kirk were far right nationalists who were killed and subsequently hailed as martyrs by their fascist movements.
Hitler brought up Wessel in all of his early speeches. The Nazis wrote songs and bullt statues of Wessel. And today we can already hear the songs about Kirk. Congressmen are passing around a bill to erect a statue of Kirk in the Capitol.
If we continue to follow this timeline closely, we are about 2 years away from our own Reichstag fire moment.
So this time around, is that 2 weeks?
That’s an interesting subject, I sometimes wonder “is our fascism progressing faster than the Nazis?”, but I haven’t really come up with a good answer.
I’ll stick with my “2 years” prediction though. I think a Reichstag fire moment is most likely when political tension is high, and political tension naturally peaks in the lead up to a presidential election.
Nope, if you talk to anyone on the right currently, everything the administration is doing right now is fine and they have broken no laws.
Oh the democrats have done much worse. When i ask them what things democrats have done that are close to what republicans do, they always bring up forcing kids to become trans or giving them hormones in school.
People really are that out of touch with reality.
Did they provide any real world examples?
They are fascists.
Period.
They fit the definition.
They are fascists.
They might be stupid fascists that don’t even know it, but that doesn’t change that they’re fascists.
And fascists are liars
To them any concept of socialism or human rights is considered communism or lgbtq+ . They smear themselves in fascist excrements, coming straight from the orange pudding’s ass.
Cut the ‘deep down they know’ bullshit. They have no principles and sincerely believe that it is their opposition, or perceived opposition, that are responsible for all things that go wrong no matter what. No matter how many people Trump fucks over or have their lives completely ruined by him, they will just blame the democrats or transgender people or homosexuals or whoever else. They genuinely cannot see what Trump and his asskissers are doing and the results it is having.
It’s more accurate to think of them as irrational beings with brain disease making them unable to think clearly. They have vague intuitions and a complete inability to think rationally.
All that a German needs to know about this incident is two words:
Reichstag Fire
(EU pls send help 🥺👉👈)
People keep saying this but I’m seeing a different thing. The Kirk murder doesn’t seem to have the seriousness required to compare. Instead, the event has turned into an us-vs.-them litmus test. The fascists can’t use this to declare autocracy, but they’re using it to target enemies.
It’s a loyalty test, yes.
Missed a detail: any criticism of the scumbag is now considered “celebration” or “justification”. We hated him before he died, but now we cannot say that. Because of the Fuhrer at all.
Dont rewrite history while its still happening, mate. Saying you dont like him because X reasons is not the issue being brought up. Its the people cheering for his death, celebrating murder and worse calling for more of it. I didnt like the cunt, but I never wanted him to fucking die. But a lot of people on this very platform are drinking and cheering. And thats ghoulish behaviour. Its not about Kirk at that point, its about the people saying it.
Maybe it should be about the factors that led to a person murdering another person and not the bystander reactions to a notable event that happened.
If you looked at Reddit, you would see that any criticism of Kirk is largely being equated to celebration or at least supporting it.
Even if you ignored that, people are getting fired in droves for saying mild things, and the fascists are trying to force people nationwide to either keep quiet or participate in memorials. Just yesterday Oklahoma tried to force their school children into a minute of silence for the monster.
And even if you ignored that, just posting Kirk’s quotes are making a lot of people angry.
And even if you ignored that, there’s a huge attack overall on the left’s free speech in general. The Nazis are declaring war on us from the administration, saying they will dismantle the left. And declare leftists terrorist groups.
None of this is okay. Open your eyes.
I can’t speak to the shooter’s motivations (though meme forensics seems pretty silly) but the “at a Right wing state with a Right wing governor” etc bits seem pretty dumb.
It’d be like saying the guy who went after Pelosi was clearly a Leftie because it was in a Leftie state, with a Left song governor, in a Left wing city against a Left wing politician. Pretty nonsense points and make us look dumb.
It’s sort of relevant because when crazy stuff happens in a Democratic state, the right points fingers and they imply that chaos is happening because of governance.
Kind of feels like the right invents their own truth and constantly does mental gymnastics. Now we are doing it? The media talked about goypher for a day and everybody jumped on it.
How are “we” doing mental gymnastics here?
Thinking this guy is right wing just because his dad is and assuming he “ironically” wrote an anti fascist song lyric on the bullet.
The media mentioned goypher once and everyone jumped on the band wagon without asking any questions.
At least the CIA nipped this Luigi before it could grow.
jumping on the band wagon without any questions… like the whole trans rhetoric on a bullet. the bullets engravings are memes and I doubt there was much thought put into them beyond being ‘for the lulz’ or some other edgelord bullshit as would be expected of a 4channer
That’s a bit my point, both sides are exhibiting the same energy at the moment. I thought Lemmy would be a bit more critical, especially since I figure it’s users are more resistant to rhetoric and manipulation.
At this point, I think even if the shooter came out and publicly declared his ideology, anybody that “guessed” wrong during the last week wouldn’t believe him.
Seems blatant to me, I’m surprised no one seems to be mentioning it.
Interesting. I hadn’t even considered that.
Do we know about the political views of the suspect? I know he supports guns but that does not make you automatically right wing
This is one of the biggest problems with our current state of polarization: we’re quick to box people into a binary; either “red” or “blue,” “left” or “right.”
Real people rarely fit neatly into those categories. When you take the time to actually map out someone’s beliefs, experiences, and values, what you find almost never looks like a solid block of one color. Instead, it’s more like a mosaic: someone might lean conservative on economic issues, progressive on social ones, independent when it comes to foreign policy, and undecided on others.
Reducing all of that complexity down to a single partisan label is not only misleading, it also fuels division. It makes it harder to have real conversations, because instead of engaging with the full person (their reasoning, contradictions, and growth), we engage with a caricature. Recognizing that most people carry a mix of beliefs forces us to slow down, listen, and resist the urge to collapse identities into overly simple categories.
The challenge is that this feels counterintuitive, especially for people who haven’t examined why they hold the views they do. It’s easier, and often more comforting, to inherit an identity or adopt a team than it is to wrestle with contradictions and gray areas. But when we refuse that deeper work, we not only misunderstand others, we also misunderstand ourselves.
In other words, the messiness is the point. People are complicated, and when we acknowledge that, we create more space for dialogue, empathy, and genuine understanding; the very things that binary polarization squeezes out.
Edit:
If you’re interested in seeing how this plays out in practice, the New York Times put together a quiz a few years back that illustrates the point really well:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/09/08/opinion/republicans-democrats-parties.html
Is there a way to interact with this quiz that doesn’t involve me giving the NYT a dollar?
Very well said, this is how i think as well. Here in switzerland it is exactly the same even though we have 5 major parties to choose from. This is also why direct democracy in switzerland is so amazing. You choose people that represent the parliment in parties while you still can vote different in referendums than your chosen party does.
From what I’ve heard, he was from a right wing family but there are conflicting reports on whether he himself was right wing
This is what i read as well. While not likely, it is totally possible he is not right wing
He was apparently dating a transgender person. That doesn’t necessarily make him left wing, but it means that in regards to transgender people, he probably didn’t fully agree with the right wing
Probably a libertarian. Non party affiliated has been growing as people arent into fascist Republicans vs fiscal conservative policy and they dont want to be a Democrat in those states.
I know we have this, you are one party of the other thing but i think the “others” is gonna get bigger as a group and already has.
From what I’ve pieced together, it’s a guy from a MAGA family that was recently radicalized, possibly in college towards left-wingism (possibly via exposure and humanization of trans room mate?). There’s not that much evidence to suggest he was a far-righter himself (the groyper claims are literally just “yeah the engravings are a dogwhistle trust me bro” but many libs here are buying it), and now it’s just turning into a war of push from both sides being like “no it’s not OUR guy it’s YOUR guy!”.
In other words, it’s impossible to tell for certain due to how deliberately muddied the waters are by everyone.
He went to UVU one semester and then left and went to trade school as an electrical apprentice. I highly doubt he got radicalized at college in Utah. He was already radicalized by his parents and family in the MAGA / Mormon spheres. It takes longer than a semester to deconstruct cult level beliefs like that. There is very little to any evidence that his roommate is trans. It is all hearsay picked up from places like 4-chan then spread to right-wing rags then spread to right wing politicans. A big loooong game of telephone. It isn’t even clear he lived there at the time of the shooting. The Daily Mail said he lives with his family in a $600,000 six-bedroom home.
The reason the trans - fan fic is getting spread by right-wingers is that the federal authorities are using it to get jurisdiction from the state since that could make it classify as a hate crime. Even if the roommate is trans that doesn’t mean they aren’t a right-wing trans person. Trans people can have shitty views just like any other group of people.
It doesn’t help that the FBI and news outlets are releasing different info to different news audiences to muddy the waters. Just the meta-data of this being the 3rd trans related storyline being pushed does not inspire confidence in it’s veracity. The first TRN one was debunked and retracted, but then they claim the engravings point to trans- ideology when that isn’t really apparent. Then they come up with another one. Sorry, not buying right-wingers making shit up to blame it on trans people.
Hold on… A hate crime? Jesus fucking Christ. Being a fascist asshole is 100% a choice. And their entire existence is a fucking hate crime.
The Trump regime doesn’t want a local jury of Mormon peers, they want to execute him federally and have control of the trial so that inconvenient information doesn’t come out.
There’s equal evidence for the groyper claim as there is for the trans roommate claim, which is to say nothing but hearsay being pushed out by the Governor of Utah.
If this kid had been “radicalized towards left-wingism” in any way, the media would be all over it and we wouldn’t be hearing the end of it.
Ding ding ding ding.
When you hear that he’s “not cooperating” today, that means the regime can’t convince him to tell everyone he’s really a liberal.
MAGA was screaming that it was a radical leftist without ANY evidence… They are just looking for an excuse to justify using force against political opponents
I am a big time left wing guy and I love guns. Of course I believe in gun control, but I do not believe in most gun bans.
His family and city was, but it pretty likely seems he was not. Hard to be a republican if you’re living with (and allegedly dating) a trans.
It was only for one semester. And you’d be surprised how many white supremacists have had relationships with non-whites.
I think “we’re” going to end up with a lot of egg on our faces the more they investigate. I believe his parents have already told the authorities that “he’s been getting more into left wing ideology in the recent years” so I’m pretty sure its just a matter of time before it’s “proven.”
The only thing people have to go off of now is some tenuous connection to Nick Fuentes that doesn’t seem too solid.
This kid was different. He is not one of us! /S
What was fucking hilarious was the governor got on to reassure all Utahns that he was not like his parents, community, or state when he clearly is.
Your musings don’t matter he has already been branded by the liars as a leftist and your just here to sweep up after them like a good lackey.
Why the hell would I want to “sweet up” after them? I even used the term “we’re” to distinguish the fact that I’m not a right winger. I’m simply trying to stick to the only facts we have, I’m not letting what I want to be real get in the way of what reality seems to be.
I’m one of the last people who wants this to be a left wing guy, but I also won’t plug my ears and choose to believe something that might not be true based on some loose connections.
Where did you see he was turning left? Given his background with groupers, he’s got Internet brain rot and is trying to play lefty while doing what he did for the reasons stated are hardcore radical right.
In an article I read they stated that his parents were supposedly saying he started turning to the left in recent years. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but it would at least partially explain his not voting for Republicans and registration as independent.
What background has been proven that he has a history with groypers? The only thing I’ve seen are the bullet engravings, but unfortunately he managed to pick every single meme that could go either way… They all have a history of starting one way and being used in another, even the helldiver’s reference could be a fascist misunderstanding the point of helldiver’s, or a left winger understanding and using it as anti-fascist.
Consider the source. Hard-core Righties consider anyone who isn’t as right wing as them to be Liberals. They could check every box in Conservative Bingo, but if they have the slightest concern about deporting people without due process, they are as Liberal as a San Francisco Homo.
You can’t let MAGAs choose the labels.
The article I saw said he was getting more “political“ recently, not explicitly more left-wing…
If you didn’t vote in '22 or '24, and had the ability, you’re not a progressive or liberal, full stop.
I wish I had it saved since I’m at work and can’t do a good enough search, but yeah the quick search I’m doing now is only pulling up “more political.” Could have been that the article was wrong and has since been corrected.
LOL.
Boomers complaining people are “turning left” cause their kid asked if Jesus really meant it when he said to feed the poor and treat others with human decency.
Yeah, it’s probably the fact that he went to college for a semester. To them that means he was indoctrinated into leftism.
Sweep up is a reference to cleaning up.
It doesn’t matter what you think or even I think. They already branded him as leftist. They are already attacking innocent people with political violence like the terrorists they are.
The reality is he was raised conservative in a conservative religion, in a conservative family, in a conservative town, and in a conservative state. He is one of them. They know this, I know this, but you seem confused.
They have a name for this and it is useful idiot.
I understand what sweep up means… I was saying that’s not what I’d want to be doing and it isn’t what I was attempting to do.
As for useful idiot, you’re literally assuming you know what you claim to be true… Just like you said, what you think or what I think doesn’t matter. I’m not “helping” them by my comment suggesting that we might end up embarrassed if they do end up having actual proof he’s a “left winger.” I’m of the mind that this is unfortunately more likely than not to be the case.
It is okay, you got caught up in the propaganda of what was his political leanings left or right. I am just here to tell you that your doing exactly what they want you to do. Hence the useful idiot
I am assuming the truth. Just like OP said. He is a product of conservative culture regardless if he embraced or denied it.
deleted by creator
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. At face value alone the alleged “Hey Fascist, Catch!” text on the casing is not something a right winger would say about their own ideological cousin, and if true as well, the shooter may have dated a trans individual. The preponderance of the circumstantial evidence we’ve been told (albeit with the caveat that we can’t trust news orgs that are kissing the ring) would seem to point towards the shooter aligning with left-leaning traits.
Edit: you downvoters need to check your cancel votes at the door. Just because there’s a possibility you might dislike the reality of the situation not turning out how you’d like.
Don’t forget the arrows after the quote, though
It’s a reference to Helldivers 2, and a sufficiently brainrotted individual might very well just put internet references on there. Which he did. And it’s not like right wingers haven’t been misusing political terms for ages. Remember the term “feminazi”?
The shooter seems to have been involved in some deep internet culture and communities. You can’t just treat it like standard opinions, but under that internet lens, which is far less straightforward and filled with codewords. From an outside perspective a lot of that might seem straight up nonsensical when put together. My point is is simply that it’s inconclusive
Not that it matters much anyhow, as republicans will pin it on the left and trans people no matter what. They’re gearing up for a genocide and will use any excuse available
It’s definitely frustrating to see people absolutely refuse to accept that it might not be what they want it to be, meanwhile they’ll point to the right and laugh when they do it.
I’m just trying not to let what I want to be true make me believe 100% that it couldn’t be anything else. It’s kinda like the Epstein distraction “meme” that’s getting a bit frustrating… Every single thing that happens is suddenly branded a distraction from Epstein, completely ignoring more realistic reasoning for what is being done… Like Venezuela, we’re going to war with Venezuela not to cover for Epstein, but for one of a few reasons: as Carlin said “we’re an oil company with a military.” or to allow deportations to continue using the foreign enemies distinction that he was denied earlier as “we aren’t at war with the cartel” … Well now we are, or will be.
Yeah, but why is this in shitpost, though.
I’m open to suggestion!
Political memes? https://lemmy.ca/c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
I often post there, but this isn’t a ‘meme’.
Here’s the recreation:LOL. I totally didn’t realize I commented on your meme, before commenting on your shit post. HUGS. So, yeah, looks like you already got all the bases covered.
I was looping the same way.
cheers,
Microblog posts? !micro@reddthat.com
Agreed!
Thanks for next time!
It’s not and should be reposted elsewhere
Shit Reality, Shit Post
It’s a Midas shitpost.
First of all, there is no Republican Party any longer, they are as dead as the Whigs. They should only be referred to in an historical or scholarly context.
They are the MAGA Party now. They have nothing in common with the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc. MAGA embraces none of those foundational tenets, instead supporting and encouraging treason, racism, corruption, violence, genocide, pedophilia, misogyny, incompetence, ignorance, intolerance, and more.
The Dems should hold a press conference, and unilaterally, but officially, declare the death of the Republican Party, and then never refer to them again, always calling them the MAGA Party. The MAGAs are proud of being Republicans, and they will go out of their minds over this.
the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc.
TBF, the GOP didn’t hold many of those values either. They wanted to increase government control over people, lower taxes only for the rich and therefore increase the national debt, values only counted if they were christian and straight, etc. The main differences with MAGA is they say the quiet part out loud and they’re more comfortable with nazis, fascists, and kings than the GOP ostensibly was.
They may not have lived by it, but they certainly were proud of it, and claimed it relentlessly. Now they don’t even try to claim smaller government, or lower taxes. They know how ludicrous it would sound.
They haven’t talked “fiscal responsibility” since they let Bush Jr. blew Clinton’s surplus. Just dropped it.
Not true. Trump was constantly slamming Biden’s poor economy, even though it was far better than Trump’s first term. They made a big show of selling the concept that MAGAs, and specifically him, know the economy better than anyone, despite decades of history showing that the economy ALWAYS tanks under the right-wing administrations.
They are the MAGA Party now. They have nothing in common with the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc.
What a load of bullshit. The Republican party has never, in my lifetime (and from everything I’ve read, since long before that) stood for those things.
They may have said that they do, but their actions speak louder than words.
I honestly cannot believe that people still say shit like this.
Whether they lived by it or not, it was the definition of their party that they offered to the world.
The fact that they don’t even try to float those concepts any more, because they know how silly they’d sound, demonstrates that they have changed.
The simple fact is that the Republican Party and the MAGA Party are now two separate entities, and should be referred to that way. And by the Dems making the unilateral choice to eject the Republicans to the dustbin of history, and force recognition of the MAGA Party, the Traditional Republicans, who think they are going to wait out MAGA, and revert to being Republicans again someday, will come to the realization that they have killed the Republican Party that they love so much.
It’s long past time that the Dems matched the MAGA’s psychological warfare.
Gotta unite the base that was fractured over the Epstein files
Cluster B’s never blame themselves.
You know there’s more to cluster b than just narcissism right?
Not everyone with a cluster b disorder is incapable of admitting fault.
Sure but you say cluster b because it never just narcissism.
No, no I don’t say that. Just like I don’t assume everyone with adhd is going to yell “squirrel” in the middle of a sentence.
It’s belittling and ableist to presume having a cluster b disorder precludes someone from being able to partake in acts of personal accountability.
The gun he used was non binary
So many of these Charlie Kirk AI generated TikTok videos popping up everywhere have to shoehorn some amount of “We hate Greta Thunberg” into them. I’m beginning to suspect these people aren’t actually sad that Kirk is dead. They’re sad that Greta Thunberg is doing something infinitely more dangerous and more inspiring, yet she managed to outlive him.
What you’re describing is clearly foreign propaganda.
A KGB spy and a CIA agent meet up in a bar for a friendly drink
“I have to admit, I’m always so impressed by Soviet propaganda. You really know how to get people worked up,” the CIA agent says.
“Thank you,” the KGB says. “We do our best but truly, it’s nothing compared to American propaganda. Your people believe everything your state media tells them.”
The CIA agent drops his drink in shock and disgust. “Thank you friend, but you must be confused… There’s no propaganda in America.”
